Pristine Grace

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  1. Thread: Purpose?

    by Stabby
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    Re: Purpose?

    Twistedanguish-

    You have stumbled upon one of the great dilemmas of all time: the http://www.tameri.com/csw/exist/] existentialist dilemma. [/url]

    One question you may want to consider.

    Do...
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    Churchmouse- Welcome to 5 Solas. You said:...

    Churchmouse-

    Welcome to 5 Solas.

    You said: So here's my thought: since "thou shalt not murder" is in the 10 commandments, shouldn't murder be constitutional since our culture is striving...
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    The issue seems to be whether all conclusions are...

    The issue seems to be whether all conclusions are an inference from the senses, and even if senses themselves are inferences.

    . Neural nets consist of layers: the input layer is the sensory...
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    Countrymouse- Thank you for your points. ...

    Countrymouse-

    Thank you for your points.

    you said: Observations, rather, lead to inferences

    Current brain research suggests that our observations are inferences.

    Observations are a...
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    Fred- A question occurred to me, can an...

    Fred-

    A question occurred to me, can an Operational Scientist be a biblical presuppositionalist?

    In order to answer this question, we need to consult the writings of Percy Bergman, The Logic...
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    Disciple- You asked: do you seriously not see...

    Disciple-

    You asked: do you seriously not see the difference between a doctor examining a patient and determining the origin of life years ago?

    I donít see a difference in methodology. ...
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    Fred- Before we continue this debate, which I...

    Fred-

    Before we continue this debate, which I will admit does take a bit of time and effort, I think we need to come to an agreement of civility.

    I'm not sure what 5-Solas's rules on civility...
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    Fred- The question seems to be, once again,...

    Fred-

    The question seems to be, once again, does operational science have anything to do with faith and/or the bible?

    Here you say the overwhelming majority of the scientific community...
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    Fred- [/color] The question is, can a...

    Fred-

    [/color]

    The question is, can a biblical presuppositionalist be a scientist as science is practiced and defined in the overwhelming majority of society. Another question, the question of...
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    Welcome to the forums Anti- [/color] What...

    Welcome to the forums Anti-

    [/color]

    What is your standard for "truly believable?"

    You do understand that what you're talking about is abiogenesis not evolution.

    Still, I think...
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    disciple- [/color] Actually, testability,...

    disciple-

    [/color]

    Actually, testability, repeatablity and rationality was Fred's definition!
    Wow, are we running about in circles are what?

    My definition of Science (which may seem...
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    Disciple- [/color] You agree then that...

    Disciple-

    [/color]

    You agree then that Faith is not Science?
    If this is true, then Fred's God Grid foundation(faith) is not a scientific standard, and therefore should not be used to judge...
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    disciple- [/color] If we predict electron...

    disciple-

    [/color]

    If we predict electron behavior in an atom smasher is that ok?
    We've never seen what minute particles will do at such energy levels.
    We're pretty sure sub-atomic particles...
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    Response to Fred's post : 6-10-03 [/color] ...

    Response to Fred's post : 6-10-03

    [/color]

    Yet the rules of biological change is evolution. That's the whole point.
    Have you heard of the Hardy-weinburg equation? It predicts gene flow given...
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    Gentlemen- There seem to be two main issues...

    Gentlemen-

    There seem to be two main issues being discussed in this thread.

    #1: Is Evolution is scientifically valid? More pointedly, is the epistemology that produces evolution thought...
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    Disciple- Thanks for reading! It has been a...

    Disciple-

    Thanks for reading! It has been a fun discussion.

    [/color]

    Iíve never said this.
    To clear up any confusion, I will confess right now, that I agree. Everyone has a bias or a...
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    Fred- Iím just reading through and responding...

    Fred-

    Iím just reading through and responding point by point. Sorry if I ramble or get distracted. My main points and questions are at the end.

    [/color]

    The bold is mine.

    Once again,...
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    Thanks for the extra time Fred. [/color] ...

    Thanks for the extra time Fred.

    [/color]

    Evolution is merely change. There is no absolute hierarchy of complexityóset out before hand, that must be followed.

    This is one of the biggest...
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    Fred- The issue lately has been if you will...

    Fred-

    The issue lately has been if you will give me a definition of an observation.
    I have given the hypothetical of the dog poop episode.

    Your rule now seems to be: If you can determine, with...
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    Fred- Once we peel away the rhetoric and ad...

    Fred-

    Once we peel away the rhetoric and ad hominem lets see what we have left from your post.

    [/color]

    Hm. Are you suggesting we can infer past occurrences by making hypothesis and tests--...
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    Fred- Thanks for doing exactly what I...

    Fred-

    Thanks for doing exactly what I predicted.
    I predicted you wouldn't define observation, because doing so would irreparably damage your position.

    You didn't define observation.
    ...
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    Fred- Repeatability is not observation. ...

    Fred-

    Repeatability is not observation.

    You can observe a one-time event. That doesn't mean we didn't observe it.

    I understand that the Ad hominem argument is very appealing and fun to...
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    Fred- Thanks for that effort. Although, its...

    Fred-

    Thanks for that effort. Although, its generally pretty useless to define Observation as something that is observed. I think this is the Begging the Question fallacy.
    What is your...
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    Fred- Concerning the definition of...

    Fred-


    Concerning the definition of "observation:" you asked.

    [/color]

    Both please.

    Thank you
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    Fred- [/color] I will grant you, it is a...

    Fred-

    [/color]

    I will grant you, it is a bit ridiculous.
    However, the Thought Experiment is very valuable. The Tom Hanks phone call thought experiment demolishes your notion of "observed vs....
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